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zippy

IAT Location

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Chase, I think I got the same IAT sensor as you (the one someone recommended off a PT.net thread.) A little curious as to why you're welding it?

 

Maybe some of your components are a little different with the vortech. With my whipple, there's a nice iron 90* elbow (the one that the aux. injectors go through) before it goes into the intake manifold. I decided to just use that piece and tap it and thread the sensor in that way. I'm probably gonna finish that task tomorrow.

 

So where are you locating the sensor?

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Chase, i dont see your times goin up with the IAT sensor location.. but going down a little. All that you made happen now is your PCM will be pulling timing a lot more because it will see hotter temps all the time... but its safer now... I know if my truck wasnt seeing boosted temps and only ambient temps, it wouldnt pull as much timing (that and the fact i get so much knock I only run 8-9* of timing 99% of the time in 3rd gear)

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Zip...

 

topic related question... what do you think of the HSRK kit Vector is selling over on TBSS.com?? Think that really helps the heat soak issues any??

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Dylan, I am willing to bet that it helps the truck stay more consistent.. especially after the truck has been sitting still warm. The PCM in these things pull timing like crazy when the IAT temps are higher. I would buy it if I were u... :thumbs:

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Chase, i dont see your times goin up with the IAT sensor location.. but going down a little.  All that you made happen now is your PCM will be pulling timing a lot more because it will see hotter temps all the time... but its safer now... I know if my truck wasnt seeing boosted temps and only ambient temps, it wouldnt pull as much timing (that and the fact i get so much knock I only run 8-9* of timing 99% of the time in 3rd gear)

 

 

ye sit will pull timing but if it doesent pull the timing kr will show and it will pull even more timing. plus you can find where to add more timing in areas that neede before.

 

im locating the iat sensor in the aluminum piping tube right before the tb, i used a bung so i can pull it out and put it back to stock if i ever wanted to. the aluminum was to thin to just tap it.

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Punkt71...looking over this post I noticed a similarity. I had the worst time getting rid of KR at the TQ converter lock up point. I would get a 3* kick everytime. Well, my converter failed (as you know) in 2200 miles. I wonder if I will see the same with my new PI or if I can add back the several * of spark I had to pull to tame the KR.

 

I did not have this issue with my 3000 stall prior to the 2600. Did I have a bad converter from the beginning :dunno: Just food for thought.

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Agree completely with you on this zippy. I ran into the same issues surrounding a whipple'd truck that I tuned a couple of months back. Just to remain on the safe side I ended up having to tune it down a bit more than I would have preferred.

 

IMO, it's not a horrible setup for running down the track if you're able to ice down the intake tract before hand, but multiple boosted runs on the street will leave the system (any system) too heat soaked, and having that IAT before the compressor is just bad news. :puke:

 

 

I will look into that.  I notice I start to get a lot of KR when I am on the freeway, and I give it some gas to change lanes/pass, and right before the converter unlocks the KR shoots up to almost 7KR (this is not WOT... but about 50% throttle, just enough to get a dowshift) I was thinking I might need to tune the converter to unlock with less throttle % or something... 

 

Also, whenever I am WOT in 3rd, and the TCC locks up (at 90mph) it almost instantly goes from 1-2KR to 5* KR right when the converter locks.... is this something that can be tuned out?

 

Thx

 

That would be real knock as the engine lugs its way into boost. I have this issue constantly in my truck if I jump into the throttle too quickly while in 4th gear under 2400rpms. A way around this is to raise your TCC release and apply speeds in 4th gear.

 

I've been unable to completely work around this yet, as no matter what my apply/release settings are, it still takes up to a full second for the TCC to actually unlock after the PCM commands it.

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Yeah it pisses me off... I was trying to pass a car on the freeway today, I floor it.. and it just falls flat on its face. Went straight up to 7.5* of KR right away, and SLOWLY tapered down.. but it felt like it wasnt going anywhere. Its pretty much useless in 3rd gear. I am thinking I might need to just have it not lock the TC until 110+ MPH WOT.

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hey anyone got pics of the sensor move.i need to do this as well just had zippy do my tune he said some of you ran into this problem and had it fixed.i just need some help kinda new.

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Punkt71...looking over this post I noticed a similarity. I had the worst time getting rid of KR at the TQ converter lock up point. I would get a 3* kick everytime. Well, my converter failed (as you know) in 2200 miles. I wonder if I will see the same with my new PI or if I can add back the several * of spark I had to pull to tame the KR.

 

I did not have this issue with my 3000 stall prior to the 2600. Did I have a bad converter from the beginning :dunno: Just food for thought.

 

 

Since you bumped it Zippy, I wanted to add to my reply here.

 

I have been able to add the timing that I had to pull at the TC lock point at WOT. I assume that my Yank TT 2600 had issues from the get-go and having it fail was a actually a good thing.

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Since you bumped it Zippy, I wanted to add to my reply here.

 

I have been able to add the timing that I had to pull at the TC lock point at WOT. I assume that my Yank TT 2600 had issues from the get-go and having it fail was a actually a good thing.

 

Here is some light to IAT SENSORS.

 

Colder inlet temps mean more timing advance can be used .Contreversly much hotter inlet temps [OFTEN A RESULT OF SUPERCHARGING] require reduced timing to avoid the knock that comes from the increased burned rate.

Ideally an IAT sensor should be placed as near to the cylinder head intake port as possible so the computer sees actual charge temp.

This allows for tighter control in supercharged applications, WHERE THE TEMP CAN VARY FROM 90 degrees to over 300 degrees in a non intercooled motor.

A good tuner can compensate for SC application with the IAT sensor installed ahead of the compressor.It is installed there for safety margins from the factory.{But not very accurate}

On all aftermarket EFI sytems the IAT is installed on the intake manifold closest to the cylinder head as i said. :D

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Good tuner or not you can't fix the IAT being on the inlet side. A good example is a member from the board who lives in Alaska. He has a 408 built for boost and running a Vortech system without an intercooler. Under wide open the IAT's read colder because underhood heat is no longer effecting the sensor's reading, but the freezing cold air outside that's rushing through at a very high rate of speed is. An S-trim Vortech without an intrercooler spinning fast enough to make 10psi of boost on a 408 is spinning fast enough that it's likely increasing the IAT's on the compressor side 60 degrees or more during a quarter mile run. What you'd as an example there is an IAT sensor that read's say 40 degrees crusing and will shoot down to 30 degrees under wide open when it should be reading about 70 degrees IAT at cruise and shooting up to say 130 degrees from there on a wide open pass. That is no way to tune for that properly. Outside air temperature readings are useless when what you need is the temperature of the air going into the cylinders. On a non-intercooled system you could see a 100 degree difference easily between the air entering the filter and air entering the intake.

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Good tuner or not you can't fix the IAT being on the inlet side. A good example is a member from the board who lives in Alaska. He has a 408 built for boost and running a Vortech system without an intercooler. Under wide open the IAT's read colder because underhood heat is no longer effecting the sensor's reading, but the freezing cold air outside that's rushing through at a very high rate of speed is. An S-trim Vortech without an intrercooler spinning fast enough to make 10psi of boost on a 408 is spinning fast enough that it's likely increasing the IAT's on the compressor side 60 degrees or more during a quarter mile run. What you'd as an example there is an IAT sensor that read's say 40 degrees crusing and will shoot down to 30 degrees under wide open when it should be reading about 70 degrees IAT at cruise and shooting up to say 130 degrees from there on a wide open pass. That is no way to tune for that properly. Outside air temperature readings are useless when what you need is the temperature of the air going into the cylinders. On a non-intercooled system you could see a 100 degree difference easily between the air entering the filter and air entering the intake.

 

I moved the IAT on the Motor Zippy's is mentioning to the boosted side,

 

On a 25 degree day, under 10psi of boost my IAT temps before the throttle body were 190-200 degrees.

 

I am running up too 180 degree's hotter then ambeint.

 

And to quote, "a good tuner can compensate" Answer.

 

I bought this Set Up for my specific truck, it had Vortech's Vin Specific program. No Other Aftermarket parts except a K&N Filter in stock airbox. And It blew up Badly!!! #7 piston was Shatered! rod bent, not much left.

 

P&S Vortech was not helpful at All. and My Warrenty Got Pulled from me!

 

~Danny

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good info zippy thats exactly why I moved mine on the blower side just before the tb. Made the world of difference.

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