TurbochargedBerserker Posted December 22, 2004 Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 Ok suspension / drag racing gurus: How should I tune rake for the best launch with the AWD? Everything is stock suspension wise, and I have no plans on changing anything unless the new motor just plain can't hook (based on Parish's new info this may be possible ). Has anyone done any track testing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
383ss Posted December 22, 2004 Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 how big of a stall and how much HP are you gonna put out? I am doubting you will have problems with a 5500lb truck and AWD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurbochargedBerserker Posted December 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 I have a PI 10.5" triple disk that stalls at about 2800. I will have 750-800 hp in street trim. Track trim... could be 1000hp if I can get the boost to where I want it with 105. Parish has his 408 in and at 10psi, he can't launch from idle in 4WD (hehe or a roll... ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vette dude Posted December 22, 2004 Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 I was always under the impression that one wanted no weight transfer in an AWD vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TurbochargedBerserker Posted December 22, 2004 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 I was always under the impression that one wanted no weight transfer in an AWD vehicle. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That seems like it would work on a true 50/50 AWD and a 50/50 weight balance. I think we are 33/67 AWD and 65/35 weight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
383ss Posted December 22, 2004 Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 I would think you would still want weight transfer to the rear. there is a point at the track where AWD is about useless and I think it's in the 11 second range for cars, maybe lower for our heavy trucks. you will launch so hard that there is very little weight on the front and the added traction is useless... but with the long wheelbase and weight, it may not be as much as an issue with the SSS. would be a very interesting project getting your truck to launch really well at the track. are you gonna use stock tires/wheels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XGMTech Posted December 22, 2004 Report Share Posted December 22, 2004 Sounds like it's going to take some experimenting, and you're going to end up being the first. Here's a couple off the top of my head: 1. Roadmaster Active Suspension, which would combat weight transfer (if you found yourself needing that), and function like traction bars and are adjustable. Someone posted about this a while back and had positive things to say about it. 2. Air bags, which would be easily adjusted to enable more weight transfer or fight weight transfer, but aren't the simple way of doing what you want. 3. I've owned a couple of El Caminos, and they all come stock with air shocks in the rear. If someone makes an air shock to fit an SS, this is also a cheap way to fight weight transfer if you need to. 4. Traction bars, here's a nice set: Summit - Traction Bars Seems like there's more solutions out there to fight weight transfer than to enable it. I've got another idea but I'll PM it to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PewterC3 Posted December 23, 2004 Report Share Posted December 23, 2004 The split is 38% front and 62% rear for the NVG-149. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vette dude Posted December 23, 2004 Report Share Posted December 23, 2004 I would think you would still want weight transfer to the rear. there is a point at the track where AWD is about useless and I think it's in the 11 second range for cars, maybe lower for our heavy trucks. you will launch so hard that there is very little weight on the front and the added traction is useless... but with the long wheelbase and weight, it may not be as much as an issue with the SSS. would be a very interesting project getting your truck to launch really well at the track. are you gonna use stock tires/wheels? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'm sorry, but i tottally dissagree with this, AWD will never be useless on the track. If a top fuel drag car could have AWD, i am sure they would be much faster... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimC3 Posted December 23, 2004 Report Share Posted December 23, 2004 I'm sure Top fuel dragsters would have AWD if it helped that much.. I saw a show once (I know... you can't believe everything that you read..) that went through the history of top fuelers and funny cars.. Somewhere in the 60's/70's (don't remember), they even experimented with two engines and then four engines (one powering each wheel).. They said that the added weight made the car slightly slower even with the extra HP and traction... Someone else add something here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wkdivr Posted December 28, 2004 Report Share Posted December 28, 2004 I'm sure Top fuel dragsters would have AWD if it helped that much.. I saw a show once (I know... you can't believe everything that you read..) that went through the history of top fuelers and funny cars.. Somewhere in the 60's/70's (don't remember), they even experimented with two engines and then four engines (one powering each wheel).. They said that the added weight made the car slightly slower even with the extra HP and traction... Someone else add something here? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Weight transfer happens no matter what, so you've got to figure out how to make it work for you in your own situation. Ideally, at launch, most of the weight transfers to the rear wheels to provide traction. THEN, you must make the weight transfer smoothly towards the front so as to aid in top end. The faster, and smoother towards the front the weight moves, the better your top end will be. I worked on a Pro Stock Truck a couple of years ago, and that was our biggest stumbling block. We could make it 60' like mad, but had no top end. OR...the 60' times sucked, and the top end would be booming. On that thing, you could make all kinds of adjustments to the suspension to fix things (or do more damage, like we would usually do). With an AWD SS, you would be very limited, except maybe for ride height. Just my $.02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted December 30, 2004 Report Share Posted December 30, 2004 Speaking in terms of production vehicles... awd is faster than rear or front wheel drive. Total vehicle weight is the killer. But does anyone remember the Cyclone and Typhoon? They smoked many a trans am and vette in their heyday. I was there... I saw it, and the vehicles were stone cold stock, just the way you first buy them. How many stock SS's have you guys seen with traction problems? I have never seen one burn off all four from a stop sign... probably never will. If you've upped the output of the motor to around 750~1000 and try to make it hook up you'll break lots of parts, but I guess that kinda goes along with the inevitable question, "Why hot rod and race a 5700 poung truck?" I don't run around my hometown looking for a race, but I have lined up with a couple of local gearheads and their best weapons, and I haven't been beaten in the launch yet! Any hotrods that do take me usually do it in the second to third shift about the time I getting out of it anyway. Yes, the extra weight from the AWD takes it's toll, but the time it saved on launch usually covers the losses from weight. I think a modded out SS pushing 1000 horsepower and hooking up enough to take advantage of the motor would have to have so many driveline mods that it wouldn't be cost effective. Or would it?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenKey Posted December 30, 2004 Report Share Posted December 30, 2004 Erik, I thought of this kind of stuff back when I had my Radix. The Radix and a good stall makes for a pretty hard launch. What would happen is the weight would transfer, the front wheels would spin, then it would go pretty good. Sometimes all four will spin. Bottom line is the rear has to be beefed up a little. I thought about it and decided to wait. My theory was that weight transfer was giving the truck a way to dissipate some of the stress of the motor's hp during launch. Not sure on how much it does it, but I'm guessing the drivetrain would be under a great deal more stress with little to no traction loss with a 750hp, 5200lb truck. A set of QA1s or Rancho 9000 adj shocks in the rear would give you the ability to adjust slightly without making it too much and start breaking stuff (my theory). I wanted to wait and let someone else try it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperDave Posted December 30, 2004 Report Share Posted December 30, 2004 Has anyone tried Airbags under the rear? They would be handy as overload springs anyway! Then of course, you could always chain or strap the front suspension so it wouldn't rise under acceleration. It's all gonna be hard on trans input shafts, transfer cases, u-joints, etc... but boys always did play rough didn't we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
383ss Posted December 30, 2004 Report Share Posted December 30, 2004 I would think you would still want weight transfer to the rear. there is a point at the track where AWD is about useless and I think it's in the 11 second range for cars, maybe lower for our heavy trucks. you will launch so hard that there is very little weight on the front and the added traction is useless... but with the long wheelbase and weight, it may not be as much as an issue with the SSS. would be a very interesting project getting your truck to launch really well at the track. are you gonna use stock tires/wheels? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'm sorry, but i tottally dissagree with this, AWD will never be useless on the track. If a top fuel drag car could have AWD, i am sure they would be much faster... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> are you kidding? a top fuel dragser carries the front wheels about 330' and there is little weight on them a lot of the way down the track. it would be USELESS on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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